Discussion: The Potential Future Use of Electric turbochargers - Club4G Forum : Mitsubishi Eclipse 4G Forums - 2006-2012 Eclipse Authority
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Old November 11th, 2019, 01:45 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Discussion: The Potential Future Use of Electric turbochargers

While poking around the internet, I found a couple companies working on an "Electric Turbo Charger" (hang with me here). I understand China has been flooding places like ebay with cast iron fans that claim to be "Electric Turbos", however, there are two companies that look like they actually COULD be making a universal Electric Turbocharger, namely TorqAmp and good ol' Garrett. While many of the turbocharging parts for our cars are either custom fabricated, or pieced together by community members as I believe Sabertooth(?) is looking to accomplish, I am curious as to everyone's opinion on these potential products. TorqAmp has released a (reasonably) comprehensive video detailing how their system would work, however it is not looking well on kickstarter.

What are everyone's opinions on a product like this?

Do you see potential to use it in the 4G GS as an "easy bolt on" alternative?

Last edited by Mevo; November 11th, 2019 at 04:50 AM.
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Old November 11th, 2019, 07:45 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Typically they work by having a motor that spins the turbo up earlier than exhaust gasses could, then the motor shuts off. These are very efficient, but are even more complex than a traditional turbo, which on the 4G69 at least I see no purpose for below 500hp. My findings are that an efficient turbo will spool nearly instantly once above boost threshold, being under 3000rpm (eg, I'm getting 15psi at 2600rpm in 5th gear on my setup)

If you put in a second high voltage electrical system though, you could definitely do a standalone setup, and it is certainly a feasible option, being an electric supercharger at that point. Downsides are the load on the engine created by the alternator, but it would still be more efficient than a typical supercharger. It would also be easier and more effective in the sense of not needing to be connected to the accessory or timing drive systems, but the downfall is that you need a custom electrical setup, and for fuel economy purposes you won't be using waste energy like a turbo does to lower the pumping losses at part throttle

There's definitely potential for both, and if you want a 1000hp GS that spools up like an OEM turbo Volkswagen, that's the answer.
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Old November 11th, 2019, 08:40 AM   #3 (permalink)
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“ If you put in a second high voltage electrical system though, you could definitely do a standalone setup, and it is certainly a feasible option, being an electric supercharger at that point. ” that’s exactly what TorqAmp is doing. They power the “turbo” by a stand alone, self recharging battery, working off a minimal charge from the cars battery to start it. Very similar set up to that of a supercharger!
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Old November 11th, 2019, 09:16 AM   #4 (permalink)
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So it pulls 12v off the battery, jumps the voltage, and puts it in another power bank.

Perfect, it saves the steps of doing it yourself.

Here's the issue with TorqAmp though.



At idle, it would be able to hold ~6psi, being limited to that. At 6000rpm it may hold 3psi, likely less (~15lbs/min of air on a GS). Any work to increase flow of the engine would result in lower boost pressures.

This isn't a theory, it's based in the same math you use choosing a compressor housing for a real turbo. It's also backed up by the dyno charts the company itself provides. It will give a large spike in torque over stock, then taper off to OEM, unless the engine is small enough. Currently, their largest E supercharger could only be good in my mind if you have a standard 1.5L or so engine, otherwise you're outflowing it quite quickly.

~170hp is the rough limit of their tech currently, which the 4G69 will do more than NA (estimated around 210-220 crank horsepower)


Their 350z chart is one of my favourites, as it shows how at high power levels their setup is actually a restriction. They carefully choose when they show horsepower, and when they show torque on their graphs to give the illusion of gains. But a 350z motor doesn't make peak torque until 4800rpm naturally, which they show it already, and peak horsepower is around 6000rpm, which from their chart you can see, horsepower is lost. It would only get worse with more modifications, resulting in increasing losses in horsepower and torque as flow rises



I wouldn't go looking in their direction yet, but the theory is solid.
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Old November 13th, 2019, 08:17 PM   #5 (permalink)
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That’s an outstanding breakdown of it all! Thank you for explaining that to me, as I am still reading up on turbochargers and superchargers (theory, how they work, what to look for, etc.). It’s definitely not perfect by any means, but maybe we could see something more refined in the future. Interesting to look out for though. Thank you!
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Old November 20th, 2019, 09:45 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Go on YouTube and watch garret1320video. He tested the cheap ones and a $2500 one from germany. The cheap ones actually took power away while the one from germany made 5psi on a base model cobalt

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Originally Posted by Mevo View Post
While poking around the internet, I found a couple companies working on an "Electric Turbo Charger" (hang with me here). I understand China has been flooding places like ebay with cast iron fans that claim to be "Electric Turbos", however, there are two companies that look like they actually COULD be making a universal Electric Turbocharger, namely TorqAmp and good ol' Garrett. While many of the turbocharging parts for our cars are either custom fabricated, or pieced together by community members as I believe Sabertooth(?) is looking to accomplish, I am curious as to everyone's opinion on these potential products. TorqAmp has released a (reasonably) comprehensive video detailing how their system would work, however it is not looking well on kickstarter.

What are everyone's opinions on a product like this?

Do you see potential to use it in the 4G GS as an "easy bolt on" alternative?
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Old November 21st, 2019, 05:30 PM   #7 (permalink)
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The cheap ones also won't add power to a weed whacker.

But if you take 6 leaf blowers and use them, you'll make boost off the line! Before again losing power, which is what that TorqAmp one would do for us too
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Old December 2nd, 2019, 12:36 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoffman View Post
Go on YouTube and watch garret1320video. He tested the cheap ones and a $2500 one from germany. The cheap ones actually took power away while the one from germany made 5psi on a base model cobalt
There's a few other hooks to the way they did this.

The torqueamp turbo outlet has a smaller diameter than the stock intake for the cobalt. When they did their test runs without the torqueamp, the intake on the cobalt was modified for the intake size of the torqueamp, so it's no-turbo runs were not technically stock configuration; if they were, it would've been faster. Now, the torqueamp still would've given them some gains but the spread would be a lot smaller than 8MPH and 1.5 seconds over a quarter mile.

The reality is, that for most cars on the market, this thing isn't going to help because to get the advertised boost, you have to restrict the intake to a diameter smaller than what is used by most modern engines, and most modern engines will take more air then this thing can supply with that restriction on higher RPMs.

If I *really* wanted to see what this thing could do, I'd stick it on a G4 Mirage, or an older 90's japanese N/A 4 that was tuned for fuel economy over performance. To handle a bigger engine, you'd need more than one torqueamp.
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