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Wheels, Tires, Brakes and Suspension Slip and slide discussion


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Old May 17th, 2011, 09:09 AM   #41 (permalink)
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but you said there was no "need" for them

and that was what I was disagreeing with, they're better in the long run and performance wise....you call it a hassle to tune them, but with drop springs you get to replace your shocks every 18 months because they're blowing out...you don't call that a hassle? or less expensive? not to mention an alignment every time you change them?

I agree it's all opinion, and we choose what hassle we're willing to go through with our cars according to our own situation.

I run on Sportlines and have replaced my shocks twice now....should probably go up to Prokits but I love the low flow ride, hard bouncy ride and all......
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Old May 17th, 2011, 12:48 PM   #42 (permalink)
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In my past experience, having dropped several cars, I have never once prematurely wore out a set of struts or shocks.

With that said, the longest i kept said cars was aprox. 4 years , and that doesnt mean it wont happen with this car, but if it does, is there not an acceptable aftermarket strut/shock available to alleviate the issue?

and ill be shocked (no pun intended) if i wear out my current struts (52K miles on them currently) in 18 months after lowering, but time will tell.

are u driving aggressively over bumps repeatedly?
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Old May 17th, 2011, 11:10 PM   #43 (permalink)
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there is another member on this very forum who has had sportlines for 2.5 years and over 45K miles with no strut issues at all.
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Old May 17th, 2011, 11:29 PM   #44 (permalink)
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i have eibach pro and have no problems, the drop was about 1.5".
by far the best choice is coilovers but the price is spicy $1000.
i have pics on my album, dunno how to post here.
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Old May 17th, 2011, 11:39 PM   #45 (permalink)
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just got mine off jack stands, sportlines installed........looking sweet so far, (actually higher than i expected, but low enough) and i can tell its going to settle a little more after i drive it
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Old May 18th, 2011, 12:52 AM   #46 (permalink)
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the only aftermarket replacements for our cars are the OEM replacements, and only if you pay for the heavy duty ones....they're an exact match from KYB, don't buy the light duty ones, dunno what those are from but the heavy duty ones are stock, and noone else sells these for our cars.......many people on here have complained about their shocks leaking after lowering, the shocks just don't like it much at all......I am quite an aggressive driver, but I take it easy on bumps, I like my magnaflow catback, don't wanna scrape it off.....
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Old May 18th, 2011, 02:08 AM   #47 (permalink)
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well, taking mine out for the first time now. Had to spend a couple hours lining up my hard tonneau cover......spyder roof been a pian in the ass so far.......Ill keep my eye on the struts and hope u have better luck your next pair
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Old May 27th, 2011, 02:23 PM   #48 (permalink)
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well, taking mine out for the first time now. Had to spend a couple hours lining up my hard tonneau cover......spyder roof been a pian in the ass so far.......Ill keep my eye on the struts and hope u have better luck your next pair
I have a 2007 Spyder GT...what was wrong with your tonneau that you had to align it? Just curious.
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Old May 27th, 2011, 04:28 PM   #49 (permalink)
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I have a 2007 Spyder GT...what was wrong with your tonneau that you had to align it? Just curious.
If u look closley at the lines between it and the rest of the body, when closed, it doesnt sit evenly on both sides. My first attempts didnt seem to do much (u loosen the mount hinge, top and bottom, from the trunk side) , and then later on, possibly through a fault of my own, it got much worse. I had used a battery hold down rod as a support rod through the hole in the hinge assembly to avoid possible bleed down while working on it.

then i forgot it was there, and tried closing it. The hydraulic motor in that system is pretty powerful. Instead of automatically turning off if it detects excessive force required trying to actuate, it just keeps running, and it was strong enough to bend the rod a fair amount. (a fairly strong rod) I realized my mistake, removed rod, then noticed one side was MUCH higher than the other at aprox. the 95% closed position for the tonneau. I dont recall if i had the hinge bolts partially loose or not at this time, but it looked terrible, and i didnt even attempt a full closing. . It was strange, as the hinge point, where the rod was temp. installed, has thick, strong metal, and appeared to be in perfect condition, but the rest of the cover seemed "tweaked". I had enough adjustment ( u dont get much, and can be hard to do by yourself) to get it looking like it did in the first place. not great, but i decided to live with it.

bought the car used, so i dont know how it looked originally

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Old May 27th, 2011, 05:10 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Of course thier better. Is the expense and potential tuning hassle's worth it for a street driven car? I would say not
what tuning hassel? (talking about coilovers) hell, for $900 you can get an awesome set that I have nothing but good things to say about. they take your car and suspension up a level and are absolutely excellent as far as ride quality and feel. You can adjust them however you want. I imagine replacing struts will add up to $900 before you know it.

I can't say enough how big of deal/difference/improvement coilovers are compared to springs. w/ springs you are still sitting on a stock strut w/ a cut-down bump stop. not good. the coils replace the whole assembly like they were made to go right in there....b/c they were. the stock struts were not made to work w/ a shorter spring.

yes, even $900 is pretty steep, but if there is anyway you can save for a few more months it is 10x more worth it. ride height? wherever you want it. spring rate? whatever you want it. toe? camber? caster? all adjustable.
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Old May 27th, 2011, 07:03 PM   #51 (permalink)
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to adjust do you have to go under the car or is there some kind of electronic thing you can use inside the car hooked up to it to change the settings?
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Old May 27th, 2011, 08:44 PM   #52 (permalink)
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^adjusting the SOFT/HARD setting is as simple as turning the 'key' on the top of the strut. to adjust everything else you have to get into your wheel well, besides the camber on the front which can be done via allen wrench on the top of the strut. adjusting some of the stuff might take a little while, but once you are done, you lock it down and you are set proper.
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Old May 28th, 2011, 07:59 AM   #53 (permalink)
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what tuning hassel? (talking about coilovers) hell, for $900 you can get an awesome set that I have nothing but good things to say about. they take your car and suspension up a level and are absolutely excellent as far as ride quality and feel. You can adjust them however you want. I imagine replacing struts will add up to $900 before you know it.

I can't say enough how big of deal/difference/improvement coilovers are compared to springs. w/ springs you are still sitting on a stock strut w/ a cut-down bump stop. not good. the coils replace the whole assembly like they were made to go right in there....b/c they were. the stock struts were not made to work w/ a shorter spring.

yes, even $900 is pretty steep, but if there is anyway you can save for a few more months it is 10x more worth it. ride height? wherever you want it. spring rate? whatever you want it. toe? camber? caster? all adjustable.
Lets try this again. I dont plan on replacing my struts. I have lowered 4 cars using either H&R or Eibach springs, and have not bought a new strut yet.

What is wrong with a stock strut and a cut down bump stop? Absolutely nothing, thats what.

you say there is no tuning hassle, then talk about all the possible adjustments! All of which i have no interest in.

Quality lowering springs do everything i want, including ride qaulity, feel, and looks. for $200 and the cost of an alignment.

The spring isnt shorter btw, same exact height as stock before installed. it just compresses differently

Not to mention, if i wanted a great handling car, I wouldnt have bought an eclipse in the first place. I wanted a rag-top that was comfortable on long drives and fairly decent on fuel economy, and the eclipse spyder is it. there are not many alternatives available

I imagine many here would be prefectly suited with lowering springs and no need for coilovers whatsoever

there is nothing wrong with lowering springs, no reason to downplay them just because you prefer coil-overs

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Old May 29th, 2011, 02:49 PM   #54 (permalink)
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^hey man, I've had both on the 4g, have you?

not trying to down play springs. get them. however, they AREN'T as good as coilovers. it's just that simple and that's all there is to it.

that is the only point I'm trying to make. If you have $$ for springs, I say save a few more months and get coils. take them to Hibdon tires or some other shop, pay them $65 and they will "tune" them for you. hardly a hassle in the slightest.

what is wrong w/ a stock strut and a cut bump stop? how about you are using a strut on a spring it was not designed for? how about you are cutting into a part that was in there for a certain strut strength/length and spring that is no longer in there?
hey if you have no problem with those things, then GREAT! bounce down the road as much as you'd like. coils replace the whole assembly w/ something that was designed to replace that function and do that job - and they do it extremely well. not to mention the weight you shed by replacing those heavy ass assemblies - and our cars need as much of a weight reduction as possible.

shit, if anyone is 'downplaying' something or presenting misleading information, I'd say it's the person acting like coilovers are some problem to "tune" or use. ask anyone on here who's had both, and see what they say.

so for everyone else. If you are trying to save money or can't afford coils. springs are fine - BUT under no circumstances will they ever be as good (feel/ride/adjustment options) as coilovers. Say $225 for springs shipped. You can get the D2s for $900 shipped. so that is a difference of $675. If it takes you 2 months to save up $225, I say save another 4 months and you can have coils and 10 x better performance, ride, look, and adjustment options. if you don't care that much then get springs. if you can't afford them, get springs and you'll be fine.
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Old May 29th, 2011, 03:39 PM   #55 (permalink)
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No, i have not had both, and i will give u that. I'm not disagreeing with u, i just dont have any problems with springs alone, and I'm not sure who would?

It all depends on your budget and what you expect in return. Im happy and your happy, so its all good.

for what its worth, I have an extensive hydraulics background, and using a srut on a spring it wasnt designed for isnt an issue whatsoever. its a dampening device, and it works proportionately to movement to dampen. Being compressed more than OEM to start with isnt a problem at all. the spring rate, which is fine with H&R / Eibach and having progressive rate is important, after that, its all good

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Old May 29th, 2011, 03:54 PM   #56 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=joeyb;561046 take them to Hibdon tires or some other shop, pay them $65 and they will "tune" them for you. hardly a hassle in the slightest.

.[/QUOTE]

Im a professional mechanic.......if you trust "Hibdon tires" to tune your coil-overs, your a fool. enough said.

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Old May 29th, 2011, 04:02 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Someone give me a link on where I can get struts for the sportlines???? My stock struts blew as I lowered the car lol the oil from the struts blew out Of them
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Old May 29th, 2011, 04:09 PM   #58 (permalink)
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.....can have coils and 10 x better performance, ride, look, and adjustment options.
10X!

are u sure about that?
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Old May 29th, 2011, 04:38 PM   #59 (permalink)
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I would say 11.3476589 times better, Joe was a little conservative
Dont you seriously think that a complete system designed to perform a certain task (coilovers) is better than 2 separate systems not designed to work together (springs + OEM struts)???
It's like wheel spacers on stock rims vs. wheels with proper offset...
Having said that, lots of people have had success with springs, and i'm sure some had issues with coilovers...
It all comes down to budget and personal preferences... Both work, but you cant deny that you have a lot more control with coilovers...
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Old May 29th, 2011, 06:27 PM   #60 (permalink)
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I would say 11.3476589 times better, Joe was a little conservative
Dont you seriously think that a complete system designed to perform a certain task (coilovers) is better than 2 separate systems not designed to work together (springs + OEM struts)???
It's like wheel spacers on stock rims vs. wheels with proper offset...
Having said that, lots of people have had success with springs, and i'm sure some had issues with coilovers...
It all comes down to budget and personal preferences... Both work, but you cant deny that you have a lot more control with coilovers...
Cheers bro's!
lol....but they are designed to work together! Do u think auto manufactures custom tune every application to its fullest potential? No, they slap a strut assembly on the production vehicle and count thier profit.

Good aftermarket spring manufactures certainly design the springs to work within the given application.

Im not suggesting u buy from Joes springs on the corner. These are german companies, renowned for quality, who devote all thier resources to making the spring work with the OEM strut.

Some of u are a a curious group, u say springs are fine, yet u still feel the need to defend coil overs in a personal manner.

If u sleep better at night because you have coil overs, more power to you, but I think ive made my point

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Old May 29th, 2011, 08:53 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Im a professional mechanic.......if you trust "Hibdon tires" to tune your coil-overs, your a fool. enough said.
guess I'm a fool for getting it perfectly aligned.

so let me get this straight: you're a professional mechanic and you think that coil-overs are a hassle to tune? wow.

and I'll say it again - springs are fine. nothing wrong with them. but not even close to coils as far as versatility, feel, ride, comfort, etc. etc. etc. the "you get what you pay for" thing applies here.
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Old May 29th, 2011, 08:56 PM   #62 (permalink)
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lol....but they are designed to work together! Do u think auto manufactures custom tune every application to its fullest potential? No, they slap a strut assembly on the production vehicle and count thier profit.

Good aftermarket spring manufactures certainly design the springs to work within the given application.

Im not suggesting u buy from Joes springs on the corner. These are german companies, renowned for quality, who devote all thier resources to making the spring work with the OEM strut.

Some of u are a a curious group, u say springs are fine, yet u still feel the need to defend coil overs in a personal manner.

If u sleep better at night because you have coil overs, more power to you, but I think ive made my point
dude, think whatever you want. I couldn't care less. I only care about other members reading this thread and that they hear from someone who's ACTUALLY had coilovers on their car. lmfao.

and I guess I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that when Mitsubishi designed the strut and bump stop the way the did, they weren't thinking "ok, let's make sure this will work well with the eibach sportline springs." or ANY springs other then OEM, ya think?
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Old May 29th, 2011, 09:22 PM   #63 (permalink)
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10X!

are u sure about that?
um, yeah. quite.
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Old May 29th, 2011, 10:50 PM   #64 (permalink)
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guess I'm a fool for getting it perfectly aligned.

.
I think u know thats not what I meant
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Old May 29th, 2011, 11:04 PM   #65 (permalink)
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and I guess I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that when Mitsubishi designed the strut and bump stop the way the did, they weren't thinking "ok, let's make sure this will work well with the eibach sportline springs." or ANY springs other then OEM, ya think?
You are good at one thing, putting words in my mouth.

your argument against lowering springs is unfounded and not backed up with any real mechanical knowledge. You clearly think changing the size of a bumpstop is some kind of huge engineering feat that should not be attempted..lmao

u jump into this thread, only to say lowering springs are fine in one breath, and then go on to bad mouth them in the next.

What was your point again? That coilovers are better than lowering springs alone?

Who are u arguing with and who is disagreeing with you?

Youve accomplished nothing but to get this discussion way off track for no good reason

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Old May 30th, 2011, 04:02 AM   #66 (permalink)
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Just cut the Oem springs and heat it up ...
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Old May 30th, 2011, 09:18 AM   #67 (permalink)
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You clearly think changing the size of a bumpstop is some kind of huge engineering feat that should not be attempted..
really? when did I even hint at that?

Actually, all I've said is cutting the bump stop is not what was intended....that's it. and the stock strut is NOT desigened to work with aftermarket springs. PERIOD. maybe it works just fine w/ no problems - who knows - but it most certainly was not designed with those springs in mind. call the design department at mitsubishi and ask them. honestly, I don't really see how you can argue that point.

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u jump into this thread, only to say lowering springs are fine in one breath, and then go on to bad mouth them in the next.
'jumping into a thread' is the whole point of a forum, my man. for members to express their opinions and trade info....again, not sure how you can take exception to that....and yes, it is possible to say a part is fine to use but still point out the cons/negatives of having that part....that is a possibility and pointing it out is for the good of the community. it's rarely all or nothing with any part. what are you implying? that springs are perfect or something? please.


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What was your point again? That coilovers are better than lowering springs alone?

Who are u arguing with and who is disagreeing with you?
the only thing I wanted to respond to was your statement on page 1 (that other people also disagreed with, btw) where you say "no need for coilovers" and that they are "not worth the 'potential' tuning hassle."

that's it and that's all. I disagree with both, and was really only asking from the beginning - "WHAT TUNING HASSLE?" a simple question you still have not managed to answer in half a dozen posts. for one, you dont' "tune" coilovers. you adjust them, mr. professional mechanic. second, implying hibdons' can't do this is baffling to me - the whole reason one takes the car to an alignment shop to begin w/ is simply because they have the laser machine to do it perfectly. I watched them do it last time - put the reflectors on the hubs, turn on the machine, look at the reading, adjust the various bolts, sliders, etc. to make them spot on, remove the reflectors and your done. I can get pretty close by myself in my garage, but the shop can do it with precision. no step in that process is a hassle....to me, anyway.

so again, just my opinion. sticking with just your original 2 statements, I disagree w/ them entirely. let's just leave it there, shall we.
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Old May 30th, 2011, 09:47 AM   #68 (permalink)
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What is this troll trying to prove? Obviously coilovers are better than springs, but not everyone needs coilovers for their application. I have ridden in Alboe's car with the MR coilovers and it was a huge difference compared to my Eibach prokit. Also, LOL @ him being a professional mechanic and saying coilovers are too hard to tune. Backyard mechanics on this site, aka joeyb, can install them without a problem yet a "proffessional mechanic" says they are too hard to "tune".
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Old May 30th, 2011, 02:42 PM   #69 (permalink)
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What is this troll trying to prove? Obviously coilovers are better than springs, but not everyone needs coilovers for their application. I have ridden in Alboe's car with the MR coilovers and it was a huge difference compared to my Eibach prokit. Also, LOL @ him being a professional mechanic and saying coilovers are too hard to tune. Backyard mechanics on this site, aka joeyb, can install them without a problem yet a "proffessional mechanic" says they are too hard to "tune".

coilovers + tune......LOL! reallly? Lets see who does better on the alignment rack
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Old June 1st, 2011, 12:58 AM   #70 (permalink)
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ya know, I'm rollin on Sportlines and I love them...but I'd throw in coilovers in in a heartbeat, because they're 12.7688437 times better than the Sportlines...and I'm a professional Plumber, and I can "tune" my own damn coilovers....just takes a little patience

I cut my bumpstops in half to install my sportlines, I'd love to be able to stiffen up those springs to keep my cd's from skipping every time I hit a crack in the street bigger than a quarter laying on it's side.....
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Old June 1st, 2011, 01:30 AM   #71 (permalink)
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your going to debate the use of the word "tune" versus "adjust" now? Not doing yourself any favors. At all. In fact im still laughing at you now.

of course you need a shop to do an alignment, unless you have an alignment machine in your back yard. YOU said u paid to have them "tuned". Lets keep it straight, shall we. Im not sure what you paid and what exact service they performed in return, but you clearly made it sound like it was more than just an alignment. why dont you clear that up? was it indeed just a simple alignment? did they adjust your ride height for you? Firmness? handling? what did they do?

my profession has nothing to do with any of this (other than my mechanical and hydraulic systems experience) which was what i based my opinion that cutting a bumpstop and using a different spring rate on a strut is not bad for the strut itself

you sure do come on strong if you only wished to disagree with my original point, which still is valid and makes perfect sense for the majority of eclipse owners out there.

"Actually, all I've said is cutting the bump stop is not what was intended....that's it. and the stock strut is NOT desigened to work with aftermarket springs. PERIOD. maybe it works just fine w/ no problems - who knows -" .......

I know, and thats what Ive been trying to tell u all along, but u already know it all, so no point in going forward

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Old September 10th, 2011, 01:54 AM   #72 (permalink)
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Ok, I just bought my 07 SE and love it, the ride is fine with me and of course it gets rough on a bad road. My question is that "visually" I want to lower it a bit, is that even a possibility without making the ride much worse than it is?
Low budget for mods so just springs is pushing it, coilovers are just out. Would the Eilbach springs keep the ride close to stock?
Car has 65k on it, would fresh struts help?
I read something online stating that the SE had a stiffer setup than the GS, is that true?
Thanx, just learning the new beast
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Old September 10th, 2011, 03:35 AM   #73 (permalink)
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Hmm at 65 I say you prob want to get new struts. Idk about the eibach since i only had progress, and now coils. Yes the SE suspension is better than a regular GS. Hope I was helpful .
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Old September 10th, 2011, 10:49 AM   #74 (permalink)
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Ok, I just bought my 07 SE and love it, the ride is fine with me and of course it gets rough on a bad road. My question is that "visually" I want to lower it a bit, is that even a possibility without making the ride much worse than it is?
Low budget for mods so just springs is pushing it, coilovers are just out. Would the Eilbach springs keep the ride close to stock?
Car has 65k on it, would fresh struts help?
I read something online stating that the SE had a stiffer setup than the GS, is that true?
Thanx, just learning the new beast
I think the OEM SE and GS springs may be the same, as the eibach uses the same springs for 6 or 4 banger.

Get the pro-kit if your really worried about your ride, will be almost stock like

sportline looks better, but your ride will be firmer than the pro-kit
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Old September 10th, 2011, 10:49 AM   #75 (permalink)
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if yoru struts are bad, replace them, if thier not, dont.
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Old September 10th, 2011, 01:15 PM   #76 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MACH1219 View Post
I think the OEM SE and GS springs may be the same, as the eibach uses the same springs for 6 or 4 banger.

Get the pro-kit if your really worried about your ride, will be almost stock like

sportline looks better, but your ride will be firmer than the pro-kit
Thanx, gonna check some pics of the Pros installed. As far as I can tell my struts are fine for now, just hope the lowering don't kill them
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Old September 10th, 2011, 04:25 PM   #77 (permalink)
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It shouldnt. thats more myth than anything
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 12:23 AM   #78 (permalink)
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After months of research, I decided to go with the Eibach Pro Kit, as I didn't plan to track but maybe once a year. It seemed coilovers would be overkill for a daily driver, but I was wrong. After 6k miles the front is now close to 2.5" drop so my fangs are scraping on every driveway at a crawl. I had the Pro Kit professionally installed btw w/ new KYBs. Totally sucks.

I cut the front bumpstops after the first month as the ride was too rough and bouncy. It helped for a while but now the ride is worse than ever. Every bump is jarring and its super bouncy on the freeway. It doesn't even feel safe to track. I took 2 coworkers to a meeting the other the day and it was downright embarrassing how rough the ride was. The ride is worse w/ the weight of passengers. I'm getting that pop/knock at low speeds too like others have mentioned.

I'm debating on Megan Coilovers or even going back to stock, which just kills me to think about. What a waste of time and money. I'd like to advise anyone considering either to go w/ coilovers, but I haven't ridden in an Eclipse with them, but I would vote a big 'no' to springs.

RRE said the difference between Tein and Megan was negligible for cost, and KW's were only worth the money if I planned making a track car. I gotta decide soon though, seems like the struts are almost completely blown. Pissed.

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Old September 23rd, 2011, 10:16 AM   #79 (permalink)
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So u cut the bumpstops yourself?

something is clearly wrong with your particular car / installation. I have sportlines, and mine rides fine.

just because it was "professionally installed" doesnt mean it was done right. Some 'professional" mechanics dont know thier head from a hole in the ground.

and i dont know how your ride can be firm and bouncy at the same time. that doesnt even make sense. if its bouncy, its not firm, and vice versa

you were not wrong. Most everybody with eibach springs have absolute no problems, so to imply you made a wrong decision and to advise against them is what would appear to be wrong

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Old September 23rd, 2011, 10:44 AM   #80 (permalink)
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Ok so I think you(blkwings) did something wrong bc I have tenzoR springs( not near as good as eibach quality) but mine are fantastic! As for cutting your bump stop that's silly bc it was designed to keep the strut from bottoming out thus blowing your shocks so you probably have run into the problem..

As for the spring issue r&d actually does go into thought for how a strut assembly is designed to work hence the reason people have blown out stock struts! The fact is that oem cars are designed to be dd's and anything aftermarket is taking the car and doing something it wasn't intended for.. Therefore people have to replace things to go along with other mods to make it work properly..

I fully agree and I'm sure the majority does that coil overs are the most efficient option for your vehicle and springs are a cheaper option for performance all that being said professional mechanics normally have mechanical abilities that separate them from others so how are coilovers confusing? I haven't owned a set of coils yet but if I'm not mistaken the pillow ball mount controls the massive amounts of camber when lower the knob on top looks like it controls damper and the locking collars control your ride height! (correct me if I'm wrong) but past that I guess you should have Joey tune/adjust them for you!

My .02$
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